356m/389yards in Primitive Flight Shooting Forum

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356m/389yards

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Kviljo	356m/389yards	Lead	[-]
Posts: 276 Jan 5 09 12:39 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Tags : None Just though I'd post a small report on what happened the 4th of January here in Norway. - 356 meters was shot by a small 57" Ipe/boo "Holmegård", of 80# @ 25". 9 ply D-75 string. Spruce arrow with Ipe footing. There's a few more pictures of the bow, and the arrow here at our norwegian forum: http://forum.bueforum.no/...k=t&sd=a&start=75
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badger5149		#1	[-]
Posts: 5348 Jan 5 09 12:44 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	WOW!!!!! Big shot you got there! More details! Steve
Kviljo		#2	[-]
Posts: 276 Jan 5 09 1:32 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	It's the old flightbow that had stability-issues, here: http://paleoplanet69529.yuku.com/topic/6273 Just shortened and re-tillered. It developed a few chrysals on the top limb, so I guess there's not much to gain by drawing it further. - although I had shot it perhaps 20 shots before it decided to shoot "properly" Most of the arrows landed just past 300m. The bow was glued up with no reflex, and had only the 1/4" natural reflex the Ipe board had. After the shoot, it had about 1/2" stringfollow. I didn't measure the string height, but my guess is around 5". The bow has been kept in a room with about 55% humidity over at least halv a year, so it shouldn't be overly dry. Not really sure about the arrow. It's Spruce with an Ipe footing, and is probably around 26" long. Made from 11/32" 70+# spine arrowshaft. No reinforcement of the nock, and no point other than the footing. Barreled of course, japanned and highly polished. The fletchings are just under an inch long parabolic, and perhaps 4/16" high. Both the arrow and the bow is in my workshop, which I won't have access to in the coming weeks, so any precise weights and measurements will have to wait For the next shoot, I will make a linnen string and shoot the same arrow once more. - although I just Love my D-75 strings, hehe.
davidc135		#3	[-]
Posts: 492 Jan 5 09 1:44 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Tremendous performance from that bow. Look forward to further details of masses and measurements of bow and arrow. David
acsmaker		#4	[-]
Posts: 208 Jan 5 09 6:51 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Good job! That would fit in the simple composite class and would be a world record! ...O.L.
KsSidewinder		#5	[-]
Posts: 1180 Jan 5 09 6:54 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Very impressive indeed. I would imagine that boo/Ipe combination would certainly have lively potential. Danny "You will know a tree by the fruit it bears" God
badger5149		#6	[-]
Posts: 5348 Jan 5 09 7:03 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	OL, because of the string that would have put him in the modern unlimited long bow class. Linen string would have put him back into the orimitive classes. Steve
acsmaker		#7	[-]
Posts: 208 Jan 5 09 7:47 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Aw...Didn't catch the string part. It would still beat 350 yards! ...O.L.
Kviljo		#8	[-]
Posts: 276 Jan 6 09 1:55 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Thanks! This is mostly thanks to you O.L., for teaching me how to make arrows. What performance-loss I could expect from a switch to linnen? I guess it would have to be near twize the diameter to embrace those 80 pounds. Wonder what it will take to break the 400-meter-barrier
badger5149		#9	[-]
Posts: 5348 Jan 7 09 11:51 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Kvillo, do you have anyway to shoot your same arrow through a chrono and see what kind of speeds you are getting out of it. I am wondering how much speed I need to hit 400 yards, I think about 255 fps would be plenty with good arrow flight but I find myself getting better distances on 350 grain arrows than I do much faster 200 grain arrows. I know it is tunning issues. I hit 362 yds a while back and checked the arrow speed and it was under 240 and not really that great of a bow. Steve
Kviljo		#10	[-]
Posts: 276 Jan 8 09 8:32 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Yep, I've got a Chrony that I will mount it in my workshop together with a shooting machine. - when I get the time to do it Or perhaps I should bring the chrony to the field and mount it in 45 degrees. It will probably have to wait for a month or two though. It sounds plausible that heavier arrows is better than lighter, up to a point. Havier with the same speed will go further, but perhaps (a little) slower and heavier will go further too? Wasn't there recently set a 403 or 404 yards world record with an english warbow?
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acsmaker		#11	[-]
Posts: 208 Jan 9 09 6:35 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	In the wood arrow classes there seems to be a middle ground on arrow weight. Our goals should be the correct spine at minimum diameter. The nature of wood is to get more stiffness we need more diameter and that means more mass. All the best wood arrows I've personally been able to make always seems to be in the 4-5 grains per pound range, at least for 70# and under bows. It's not really the "weight" causing the problem, it's being able to get the arrows out of the bows clean with proper tuning. Chrono numbers don't mean a thing is the arrow is flying sideways out of the bow....O.L.
badger5149		#12	[-]
Posts: 5348 Jan 9 09 7:43 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	O.L. I am very much aware of the need for clean arrow flight and have seen clean arrow flight from light arrows, just haven't been able to accomplish it very often beyond a fluke arrow here and there. I seem to get better flight from more forward foc but then I cant maintain the spine well enough on the light arrows with a forward foc. about 5 grains per pound does seem to be optimum for me. Once I go below 200 grains, the tail waggers get pretty bad. At about 6 grains per pound I seem to be able to get pretty consistent flight but not quite the distance I need. Steve
jwillis1961		#13	[-]
Posts: 125 Jan 19 09 9:53 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Thats a really beautifully made bow and arrow! Great job and thanks for posting the good pics of your shoot. Jim
Kviljo		#14	[-]
Posts: 276 Jan 19 09 2:28 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Thanks! My next step will probably be to minimize the size of the feathers. I've been keeping them at a safe size for a while now. By the way, would this kind of sentershot handle be allowed in the simple complex class? There's no shelf on it, but it is pretty close to centershot. It seems that it is much easier to get proper arrow flight with such a handle.
acsmaker		#15	[-]
Posts: 208 Jan 28 09 7:32 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Kviljo, " would this kind of sentershot handle be allowed in the simple complex class? There's no shelf on it, but it is pretty close to centershot. It seems that it is much easier to get proper arrow flight with such a handle." Attempting to achive centershot in the classes requiring wood arrows is a mistake. The closer to center you are, the higher spine that's required and that means more diameter with more drag.....O.L.
Kviljo		#16	[-]
Posts: 276 Jan 28 09 8:54 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Umm, not following that one...? The closer to center, the less friction against the bow, and the less the arrow has to bend around, giving it less time to vibrate in flight? I don't see how a wider handle can be an advantage over a 100% or close to 100% centershot handle?
badger5149		#17	[-]
Posts: 5348 Jan 28 09 9:46 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Kvillo, what he is saying is that a center shot bow need stiffer spine arrows and that in wood arrow classes stiffer spine is always a problem because of the low weight of the arrows and the difficulty in maintaining any forward foc. I have been thinking about what OL said for a while now and it makes sense, I know my arrows have been underspined somewhat but hadn't considered a need to move away from centershot. Steve
acsmaker		#18	[-]
Posts: 208 Jan 28 09 11:24 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	The last thing a finger shooter wants is a "centershot" bow. About 1 arrow diameter outside of center is about optimum but a little further outside doesn't hurt anything. the closer to center, the more difficult the bow is to tune with fingers. The closer to center, the stiffer the arrow has to be, the less it bends, the closer to the bow it tries to fly making them much less forgiving to our release errors. Do not confuse "centershot" with "center cut"...Two different things. "Center cut" is a long way from "centershot"....O.L.
badger5149		#19	[-]
Posts: 5348 Jan 28 09 1:32 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I usually cut mine either on center or just slightly past center. I think I will try moving over maybe 1/4". Steve
Kviljo		#20	[-]
Posts: 276 Jan 28 09 1:44 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Centershot is when the arrow is shot from the middle of the string, while center cut is where the center is cut out of the bow to make space for the arrow (like on my bow)? Or the other way around, or something completely different?* I do see the correlation between wider grips and less arrow spine, but I don't see how it could be an advantage making the arrow bend more? But what you are saying is that it is easier to get the arrow to touch the bow as little as possible when the bow is a little away from centershot? - and that there is more to gain in distance by this than having the arrow vibrate less out from the bow? Sorry for having to repeat, but sometimes the language-barrier is blocking my train of thought. With regards to spine, I figured it would be easier to make the bow centershot and just make the arrows as stiff as possible, instead of having to pin-point the perfect spine for each bow. - But perhaps the spine-tollerance-window is wider for a near-centershot* bow than in a 100% centershot* bow? I wouldn't be able to tell if the advantage would be greater than the advantage I think I see with having the arrow vibrate or swim less out from the bow, without doing some thorough testing. - has that been done? Interesting stuff! Last Edited By: Kviljo Jan 28 09 1:48 PM. Edited 1 times.
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356m/389yards

356m/389yards