ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Blattspitze) — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 14:42:42 GMT

Enjoyed reading this thread, also the australian hijacking of it!
Aside of a religious meaning, could red color pigment have played also a more pragmatic role? What about red colored hides and clothing? Can red pigment (over here often made of roasted Iron ores) have a positive effect on tanning?
Marquardt

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (AMH) — Wed, 11 Jun 2008 17:23:13 GMT

Hello all. I'm new here, and I enjoyed reading this thread. Lots of info. We will never know when or why early humans started using red ochre (hematite), but it was mined in great quantities all over the world. In addition to it's decorative and symbolic uses, it is also an effective insect repellent and sunscreen. I have no idea if it was used for that though. It may have other practical uses, at least to paleo man.

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Danggali) — Tue, 06 May 2008 19:01:01 GMT

LOL ..... Well i haven't read that book or heard of those others. But I do recall a poem from primary school when I was just a little fella

The first bird I ever shot in Ameriky was a pork-y-pine
I treed him up a haystack...
shot him with a barn shovel..
Why ... the first time I shot him I dang missed him
the second time I shot him ... I hit him in the same place..
Man ... how those feathers flew !!

LOL ... I gotta admit ... I never really...

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (scalpcreek2) — Tue, 06 May 2008 16:34:45 GMT

Greg, if you want a pretty good education on the American "mountain man" times, get the book called "Give Your Heart to the Hawks" by Win Blevins. Read about Hugh Glass gettin mauled by a Grizzly bear in 1823, John Colter running naked from captivity by indians, Jedediah Smith, Kit Carson, etc. Lots of good mountainman words in there...wagh!
"They tried to git me outen the notion, but I swar an I'll stick to it, this child saw a heap more of the all fired...

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Danggali) — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 22:56:09 GMT

Well I had never heard that term before. You learn every day. Thanks for that Quills

cool bananas ... greg

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Quillsnkiko) — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 21:47:10 GMT

waugh.... is a old...... Mountain man term from the fur trapping era ...that means the person is in agreement with what was said. something .... jeramiah johnson would have said.. or fitzpatrick.

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Danggali) — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 02:33:59 GMT

Is that a War Cry of Commendation or opprobation ?? LOL

cool bananas ... greg

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Shuvani) — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 02:16:26 GMT

Waugh!

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Danggali) — Sat, 05 Apr 2008 01:48:19 GMT

Quills ... I think if we were to defer to them and allow indigenous peoples to advise us on the environment then my hopes for the future would be much, much brighter.

I am not an alternative type person. but I think that by living in an artificial environment, concrete jungle, metal vehicles, and by insulating ourselves against the sun, the rain, the temperature, the humidity and making this artificial environment the norm that we are heading for a fall.

People who live in...

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Quillsnkiko) — Fri, 04 Apr 2008 08:40:36 GMT

Well Greg..your explanation of how the australain native folks feel about the land ..pretty much sums up my understanding of how....... Native Americans feel about the land. They do not own the land..no one.... owns.... the land but it was left in their safekeeping ... as the residence of the bones of their ancestors.. to be kept in safekeeping for those unborn.
The land like everything else ..is a relative . the land is Mother .....Earth...is the thing that sustains all of creation...

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Danggali) — Fri, 04 Apr 2008 01:25:20 GMT

Quote: ScalpCreek

I am a bit surprised that you can not even collect surface artifacts in Oz. Is...

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Quillsnkiko) — Thu, 03 Apr 2008 08:40:38 GMT

Geepers I did not even see the resembelance to a ibex in the small copy but certainly do in the larger version . cool.
Hope you have success in finding some things to make castings of....... at least. Too bad you cannot at least pick up surface things. But it is the same way here in the US in some places especially parks ..where it is illegal to take anything out....... and .....since I can't run fast enough any more I have to abide by the rules. LOL !!!

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (scalpcreek2) — Thu, 03 Apr 2008 06:53:06 GMT

I am a bit surprised that you can not even collect surface artifacts in Oz. Is that the law there? Oz has some very strict laws. My friend in Taz tells me that there are quite a number of hoodlums, who rob stores, people and vandalize private property there, and that police protection is somewhat lax. and I know you guys have very strict firearms laws too.
Here in the USA in some areas you can not collect suface artifacts, other places you can. All depends on state laws mostly...at...

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Danggali) — Wed, 02 Apr 2008 22:47:12 GMT

That dog being a very old species would tie in with the non-barking. And they do have a Dingo build. Its possible they are an asian breed that have been segregated in japan. Nice looking dog.

A lot of people ask me about the Avartar but really its nothing special. It is just an Ibex (I think) It was found decorating an ancient clay pot but I don't know where or when. I just scribbled it down and drew it on the computer. Its almost an exact copy of the original artists version....

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Quillsnkiko) — Wed, 02 Apr 2008 21:43:27 GMT

Yes, they are a very old species of dog..found in ancient Japanese burials....going way back.I have a friend in Japan who has told me some about them as well as having some books on Shibas.
Dna wise there has been some recent research and Shibas are one of the 14 dog breeds that are most closely related to wolves..so they say. When I saw a show by steve Irwin on Dingos in australia... the pictures looked very much like a Shiba except the Dingos did not have the white on them.
Saami...

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Danggali) — Wed, 02 Apr 2008 13:01:17 GMT

I didn't know what a Shiba Inu was. So I looked it up in the Wiki. It appears you have a japanese dog. Couldn't find a reference to a Saami relating to dogs ? If Shibas don't bark its possible (I'm only guessing) that they are a very old species.

cool bananas ... Greg

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Quillsnkiko) — Wed, 02 Apr 2008 10:58:16 GMT

That...is one of the things I like about Shiba Inu's ..they...... hardly ever bark. They do however scream,..... howl ( when I play my harmonica LOL ) . My female barks when some one comes she does not know.... however...... females being what they are ..(I can see the definite difference between her and my male Saami sun...LOL !! ) She always has to have the LAST word!!!! hahaha!! Quills

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Danggali) — Tue, 01 Apr 2008 22:21:07 GMT

Quote: Quillsnkiko

As you can see we have some shining times around the camfire. By the way the...

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (scalpcreek2) — Tue, 01 Apr 2008 13:08:44 GMT

well, I am believe strongly that the "tattoo' was a big thing for ancient peoples from the "ice man" to the Caddo and Wichita tribes of NA at first contact, to many other cultures around the world, and think that the red ochre and the tat went hand in hand you might say. A form of decoration that had a lot of power, symbolism etc in ancient cultures. I suspect if they were to ever find a frozen clovis man with his/her skin in tact that it would have tats on it. I often...

Re: ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (Lee Olsen) — Tue, 01 Apr 2008 12:39:53 GMT

I'm not certain if any ochre has been found in Neanderthal graves, but they were big on red ochre
and other pigments.
In western Europe, during the transition to early Upper industries, those sites occupied by Neanderthals
clearly show heavier pigment use than those occupied by Homo sapiens.

ochre covered burials.....purpose of ochre?

feeds@yuku.com (scalpcreek2) — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 06:15:26 GMT

In reading about the 2 Horn Shelter Texas burials that both bodies were covered in ochre....and ochre being found in many of the "clovis caches" which were most likely burial goods, i have my guess as to why a deceased person of that time would be covered in ochre. My guess is that it was to give the color of the deceased person, a more life like appearance, and hide the palor of death, the greyish -blackish color of a deceased person. Has anyone seen any other speculation as to...